[Zeta]

Hi, I bought my first drum set three weeks ago and never played before. I try to practice every day for at least 1.5 hours or more and having a lot of fun. I currently work on a couple of the basic drum beats together with some drum fills and would like to know if it's better to practice with or without music.
I usually start without music, using a metronome, but after a while I play to some of the songs you can download here on the site or to some others I found on the internet. Would you say it makes a difference? Because playing to music is a lot more fun

Thx, Daniel.

[AN0NYM0US]

playing to music gives you all the other instruments as a reference

dont mix up playing and practicing. theyre 2 differnt things

[realscotch]

Zeta, on 22 February 2012 - 07:55 AM, said:

Hi, I bought my first drum set three weeks ago and never played before. I try to practice every day for at least 1.5 hours or more and having a lot of fun. I currently work on a couple of the basic drum beats together with some drum fills and would like to know if it's better to practice with or without music.
I usually start without music, using a metronome, but after a while I play to some of the songs you can download here on the site or to some others I found on the internet. Would you say it makes a difference? Because playing to music is a lot more fun

Thx, Daniel.

Yes playing to music is fun, but at 3 weeks, I would work on the basics, rudiments, 4 way coordination, etc.

Get those down first and playing along to music will be more fun and a little easier.

[Poco Askew]

I agree with the above.
There is nothing wrong with playing to music and having some fun to stay motivated (if that's what it takes), but it is not practice. You need to practice too if you want to get better at any instrument. Grip, posture, technique, timing, counting, reading, coordination, rudiments, etc.

[sasman999]

Hi Daniel,

Im relativly new to drumming myself also, I too started out like you, little bit of "practice" with a metronome going through the rudiments etc and then sticking on some music and bashing along with it, great fun but I found that the music took over and I neglected the importance of the basics, what I tend to do now is if I have say a 2 hour session planned I will spend the first 45 minutes going over rudiments etc, then stick the music on and blast out for 30 minutes or so and then finish with a final session of the essentials (minus music) I find this has helped me so much and has speeded up my development. The more familiar you become with things like rudiments/timing etc the easier it then becomes to translate this to the kit when the music is playing, and vice versa, the more you become comfortable playing along to music the easier you will find it to place your paradiddles, rolls, flams accents etc into something "musically" and for me thats the key. But TBH its all down to personal preferance, what works for some may not work for others, as long as you strike (forgive the pun) a balance and you can gauge your progress then do what suits you as I firmly believe to learn somethng you need enjoyment as an essential ingrediant and for me whilst rudiments etc are essential they are a lot less fun than jamming to your fav tracks.

Happy drumming my friend
Scott

[Tyger]

Absolutely! There are many songs you can play the basic rockbeat to. This will help with your timing and groove. As mentioned sometimes I like to incorporate what I'm working on with a particular song. Just makes things more fun which is key to keep things interesting. Have fun learning!

[bnsfnut]

If you want to play music at a begginer level play begginer songs... duh Stuff like AC/DC or older U2 songs. They're all great and just about every band has at least one song with the basic rock beat for part of the song.

And remember that you don't always have to play the music exactly how it's written or played. As we all know, every drummers style is different, so let your style show in your covers.

[realscotch]

bnsfnut, on 25 February 2012 - 02:27 PM, said:

If you want to play music at a begginer level play begginer songs... duh Stuff like AC/DC or older U2 songs. They're all great and just about every band has at least one song with the basic rock beat for part of the song.

And remember that you don't always have to play the music exactly how it's written or played. As we all know, every drummers style is different, so let your style show in your covers.

With all due respects to Zeta, he doesn't have a style yet. At 3 weeks, at best, you are barely playing the most basic patterns.

Get a book on rudiments, 4 way coordination, and Stone's Stick Control. Work with that for a year and Zeta will be able to play along with a lot more complex stuff than AC DC.

[ROGERSTEADMAN]

i agree with most that has been said but imo i think playing alog does let you learn and it is a form of practice at least i know it was for me it allowed me to know what to look for in a song like where to come in what to listen for what kind of fills sound good or are applicable to certain parts of music itself as a whole. i think you can use it as a base to begin your career but break it up a little bit do the basic practicing and then do the play along especially to live music because it is a more raw and obvious for on the fly beat changes. thats how i feel about it it takes both but i dont think playing along to music just as much as practicing rudiments or at least as much total time commited plus it makes it more fun and gives you a little more experience for when you start playing with people...i mean your not planning to play drums by yourself with no other people the rest of your life. in my opinion

[realscotch]

ROGERSTEADMAN, on 12 March 2012 - 10:32 AM, said:

i agree with most that has been said but imo i think playing alog does let you learn and it is a form of practice at least i know it was for me it allowed me to know what to look for in a song like where to come in what to listen for what kind of fills sound good or are applicable to certain parts of music itself as a whole. i think you can use it as a base to begin your career but break it up a little bit do the basic practicing and then do the play along especially to live music because it is a more raw and obvious for on the fly beat changes. thats how i feel about it it takes both but i dont think playing along to music just as much as practicing rudiments or at least as much total time commited plus it makes it more fun and gives you a little more experience for when you start playing with people...i mean your not planning to play drums by yourself with no other people the rest of your life. in my opinion

If he (she) were playing 6 months, I wouldn't disagree with you. Everybody seems to be in a rush to play along with something.

We are talking 3 weeks. At 3 weeks even AC/DC is complex.


You don't really have any rudiments down, you are still having a hard time with 4 way coordination, and the last thing you need is to play along to songs, no matter how simple.

Get the basics down first.

[ROGERSTEADMAN]

yes i feel that the basics are important upfront but i remember when i first started the day i got my first drumset i sat down with my head phones and couldnt wait to play my favorite songs on my kit i had no prior knowledge or training or teachings and i loved it... yes i could not play very well at all even on the simplest songs but i had fun doing it and thats what this is about right i play for fun not just money i mean i love the extra money it brings in but its not why i started and if the money and sponsorships left id still play but thats just me i think fun and full set experience is still important to playing AND BEING WELL ROUNDED I THINK YOU HAVE TO TEACH YOURSELF SOMETHINGS
dont get me wrong i took lessons for 2 years and i learned so much in that 2 times a week in the lessons, im not the greatest drummer there is but i do believe this

[realscotch]

ROGERSTEADMAN, on 12 March 2012 - 02:56 PM, said:

yes i feel that the basics are important upfront but i remember when i first started the day i got my first drumset i sat down with my head phones and couldnt wait to play my favorite songs on my kit i had no prior knowledge or training or teachings and i loved it... yes i could not play very well at all even on the simplest songs but i had fun doing it and thats what this is about right i play for fun not just money i mean i love the extra money it brings in but its not why i started and if the money and sponsorships left id still play but thats just me i think fun and full set experience is still important to playing AND BEING WELL ROUNDED I THINK YOU HAVE TO TEACH YOURSELF SOMETHINGS
dont get me wrong i took lessons for 2 years and i learned so much in that 2 times a week in the lessons, im not the greatest drummer there is but i do believe this

I've been at this for over 50 years, and played pro for 35 years, 40 if I want to count a band I traveled with before I went into the service. So I have a rough idea about the playing of drums.

One thing I know for sure, is that people who rush into it and are playing in bands 6 months after they start, usually turn out to be bad drummers. Mainly because they get caught up in the playing of songs when they should be learning the basics. They get caught up in what they are playing and never give themselves a chance to listen to a variety of styles of music.
They become 1 trick ponys.

Don't give me a list of famous drummers who did it the way you describe, because there are always exceptions to the rule, but they are rare, and a lot of drummers that say they did it that way are usually full of it.

Learn the damn basics to make it easier on themselves. Everybody is in a rush. If you want to be a good all around drummer, you have to have patience. Guitar players don't learn a couple of scales and sit down and play Malaguena, what makes anyone think drummers are different.

[ROGERSTEADMAN]

realscotch, on 12 March 2012 - 03:28 PM, said:

I've been at this for over 50 years, and played pro for 35 years, 40 if I want to count a band I traveled with before I went into the service. So I have a rough idea about the playing of drums.

One thing I know for sure, is that people who rush into it and are playing in bands 6 months after they start, usually turn out to be bad drummers. Mainly because they get caught up in the playing of songs when they should be learning the basics. They get caught up in what they are playing and never give themselves a chance to listen to a variety of styles of music.
They become 1 trick ponys.

Don't give me a list of famous drummers who did it the way you describe, because there are always exceptions to the rule, but they are rare, and a lot of drummers that say they did it that way are usually full of it.

Learn the damn basics to make it easier on themselves. Everybody is in a rush. If you want to be a good all around drummer, you have to have patience. Guitar players don't learn a couple of scales and sit down and play Malaguena, what makes anyone think drummers are different.

i agree with you 100 percent i just think it needs to be fun as well as sitting down and rudimentary practicing and coordination excercizes maybe like 70 percent basics 30 percent play alongs not with bands but to songs that were recorded to a click track thats all im saying

[realscotch]

ROGERSTEADMAN, on 12 March 2012 - 03:33 PM, said:

i agree with you 100 percent i just think it needs to be fun as well as sitting down and rudimentary practicing and coordination excercizes maybe like 70 percent basics 30 percent play alongs not with bands but to songs that were recorded to a click track thats all im saying

No instrument is "fun" for the first 3-6 months. We, as musicians, choose to play whatever instrument we play. We then subject ourselves to finding coordination that we assumed we would have only to find out that when our right and left hands start, our feet stop. When we get our feet going, our hands stop.

Once we have been playing for a while, (in my case, a really long time) we tend to forget all the things that made us nuts in the beginning, and, when we see somebody just starting out, it's easy to say "yeah, it's fine to play with music", forgetting the fact that that person doesn't have really any coordination at all, at least not coordination as we know it as (supposedly) experienced drummers.

My personal opinion has always been that you spend that first year learning the rudiments, the coordination between hands and feet, and, what I feel gets overlooked, learning to hold the sticks the correct way. If you can take lessons, take them, but, make sure you get a good teacher.

If someone really wants to play drums (or any instrument for that matter) they will put that time in and accept the fact that there is a learning process that will lead them up to the point of playing with music.
It doesn't come overnight, and it's frustrating, especially those first couple of months. That's why e-bay is loaded with all instruments, put there a lot of the time by people who thought it was going to be easier than it turned out to be.

Patience, you must have patience, knowing that in the long run, it will pay off.

[einarabelc5]

realscotch, on 12 March 2012 - 06:18 PM, said:

No instrument is "fun" for the first 3-6 months. We, as musicians, choose to play whatever instrument we play. We then subject ourselves to finding coordination that we assumed we would have only to find out that when our right and left hands start, our feet stop. When we get our feet going, our hands stop.

Once we have been playing for a while, (in my case, a really long time) we tend to forget all the things that made us nuts in the beginning, and, when we see somebody just starting out, it's easy to say "yeah, it's fine to play with music", forgetting the fact that that person doesn't have really any coordination at all, at least not coordination as we know it as (supposedly) experienced drummers.

My personal opinion has always been that you spend that first year learning the rudiments, the coordination between hands and feet, and, what I feel gets overlooked, learning to hold the sticks the correct way. If you can take lessons, take them, but, make sure you get a good teacher.

If someone really wants to play drums (or any instrument for that matter) they will put that time in and accept the fact that there is a learning process that will lead them up to the point of playing with music.
It doesn't come overnight, and it's frustrating, especially those first couple of months. That's why e-bay is loaded with all instruments, put there a lot of the time by people who thought it was going to be easier than it turned out to be.

Patience, you must have patience, knowing that in the long run, it will pay off.

I wish I could give you 100 positive votes scotch. Heck, it took me 6 months just to learn to hold the sticks well. I've been drumming for 10 months now and I barely dominate the single stroke and that's only with my right hand, I am just starting with the double stroke, barely touched 4 way coordination, can barely play bass drum and the only songs that are at my level are Ringo Star songs or Charlie Watts songs (there's a huge difference between playing them now and then though). I can't even play most Led Zeppelin songs because I don't dominate fills well enough. If I try to play to the jazz track my electronic drum set has at 250 bpm and 7 by 4, I get a heart attack!!

This post has been edited by einarabelc5: 13 March 2012 - 11:57 AM

[realscotch]

einarabelc5, on 13 March 2012 - 11:34 AM, said:

I wish I could give you 100 positive votes scotch. Heck, it took me 6 months just to learn to hold the sticks well. I've been drumming for 10 months now and I barely dominate the single stroke and that's only with my right hand, am just starting with the double stroke, barely touched 4 way coordination, can barely play bass drum and the only songs that are at my level are Ringo Star songs or Charlie Watts songs (there's a huge difference between playing them now and then at the beginning though). I can't even play Led Zeppelin. If I try to play to the jazz track my electronic drum set has at 250 bpm and 7 by 4, I get a heart attack!!

There are no "easy" instruments to learn.

I've been at this for almost 56 years, and, I'm still learning. Anytime that I've run into someone who thought they had it down pat, I knew that, in reality, they probably sucked.

If you want to be good at playing, be prepared to spend the rest of your life learning, because no one will never know it all.

[Astromar]

I agree with both realscotch and ROGERSTEADMAN but I disagree with the instrument playing not being fun for the first 3 to 6 months. I practiced for about a month without music and then I started playing music and now I've been playing for a year and 3 months and I'm no sucky drummer just because I only waited a month to start playing to music. You need some fun from the beginning so you dont lose your motivation and quit drumming completely. So to answer the question that this thread was suppossed to be about. If you plan and hour long practice a day then do 50 minutes on different basics and rudiments without music then for the last 10 minutes play to some easy songs and when you get better you can start playing harder and more complicated music.

[realscotch]

Astromar, on 14 March 2012 - 05:13 PM, said:

I agree with both realscotch and ROGERSTEADMAN but I disagree with the instrument playing not being fun for the first 3 to 6 months. I practiced for about a month without music and then I started playing music and now I've been playing for a year and 3 months and I'm no sucky drummer just because I only waited a month to start playing to music. You need some fun from the beginning so you dont lose your motivation and quit drumming completely. So to answer the question that this thread was suppossed to be about. If you plan and hour long practice a day then do 50 minutes on different basics and rudiments without music then for the last 10 minutes play to some easy songs and when you get better you can start playing harder and more complicated music.

Your post is both right on some points and wrong on others.

If someone choses to play drums and needs constant motivation to practice, maybe they are not really cut out to play. The "want" to play should be all the motivation you need.

When someone just starting sees drummers on TV, DVD's, the net, live, whatever, and sees them zipping around the set with apparent ease and they are having a hard time getting a single stroke roll down, it's not "fun". You want to be able to do that, but you can't, and you won't be able to do it for years.

I know that playing to music is fun, but, every minute of your practice time you spend playing to music is time taken away from learning the things you need to know to be able walk into a blind audition at some time and know that you can play whatever they throw at you.

If that were the case, why not go to college, start as a senior, get your diploma, and go off into the world. All you would be lacking is the fundamentals.

Bad analogy, but, I think you get my drift. Learning enough drums to play in a band can be done in a fairly short period of time. Are they good drummers, probably not.

There is a learning process, if you want to be a good drummer, you go through that process. If you skip that learning process and learn a couple of beats and think you are ready for anything, old guys like me will run rings around you every time.

[Tekker]

realscotch, on 14 March 2012 - 06:39 PM, said:

If someone choses to play drums and needs constant motivation to practice, maybe they are not really cut out to play. The "want" to play should be all the motivation you need.

I don't think that is true at all...Just knowing how I was when I started playing music at 15 years old, I probably wouldn't be playing music to this day if I would have had some boring stuffy teacher that made practicing a chore instead of fun. So who's to say that I wasn't cut out to play? Because, here I am still playing music some 15 years later. If it's not fun and you don't enjoy what you are doing then you will probably loose the "WANT" to play.

If playing to music helps keep you motivated and allows you to enjoy your craft, then do it! I started out playing to music right away...I never had any lessons, I was never taught proper technique, I didn't start out playing rudiments, etc. I learned by playing to music. So I don't think it is going to kill anyone to spend some of your practice time playing along with music. Who cares if you can't keep up exactly with the coordination, or if you get off time? If anything this will likely motivate you that much more to practice so that you can keep up with the music.

Do whatever you need to do to make sure that you enjoying playing and stick with it. That will make you a better drummer in the long run than if you get bored and quit.

-tkr

[Tamatrainee]

As stated by others - there are two sides to this and both are true, although not equally so.
As a beginner, two and a half years ago, I started the "proper" way with metronome, rudiments and lessons via the Rock Drumming System.
Within a few weeks, I was playing along to songs, badly, but enjoying it.
Both of the above motivated me to continue, with both.
I can play all of the lessons in the three RDS books although most of them are slow and therefore I continue with them to improve on speed.
I have added a few other books (Bass Drum Secrets, Drum Rudiment System and Mike Michalkow's Rock Drumming book) and so I am continuing to learn and improve.
I hope to take lessons from an instructor next year when I retire and have more time to practice.
I also continue with playing along to songs as a "reward" for the practice and I can do about 10 songs reasonably well.
I think that the danger with playing along to songs is that once you think that you are good at it (which you aren't) that you join a band and ditch the formal training.